Digitalbits says upconverting players don't work

Bill Hunt is at it again. He claims that Toshiba's goal to make upconverting players play SD in an HD quality picture won't work. Read here...

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For the record, this idea that upconverted standard DVD video quality will EVER look as good as true high-definition video is complete hogwash. Upconverting basically takes 480p video and mathematically adds scan lines to increase the effective output resolution to 1080p. The problem is that this process effectively magnifies the original video image. So if the 480p video has warts or defects (whether on the original film print or compression artifacting in the DVD master), those are going to be even more noticeable when upconverted. It's the old "garbage in, garbage out" principle. On the other hand, many of the new transfers being done for true high-definition releases on Blu-ray (and for a time HD-DVD) are actually being done at 2K or even 4K or higher resolution, and then they're downconverted to 1080p. That allows the maximum possible image detail to be included in the signal. An upconverted 480p DVD is NEVER going to be able to compete with that. That's not to say that upconverted DVDs may not be good enough for some consumers, but this idea that you won't be able to tell the difference is utter nonsense. Anyone who becomes interested in high-def, and there are more and more such consumers all the time, will see right through this.

Okay, yeah, a 480 line image pushed to deliver 1080 will not necessarily be a true 1080. But the fact that a player - be it HD, BR, or SD - can redo the picture and put forth an image that enhances the original is IMHO acceptable. I know that BR is mastered specifically for HDTVs, but an upconverting player is another alternative to help make the SD picture more of a higher quality.

I must add that with upconverting players and DVD, it's going to make Blu-Rays competition more stiff than imagined. They would be doing themselves a favor by lowering prices to be more accessible. High prices, will not make adopting a format easy, it will instead make the current format more secure.

Pretty bold statements. Alls I know is on my ISF calibrated and modded Mits 65815 fed by my Oppo and HD DVD players playing the same movie (upconverted SDVD vs. HD DVD), close up scenes can be EXTREMELY difficult to choose between when flipping back and forth. Obviously, when regarding intricate details in the background, the HD DVD picture is much cleaner, but I wouldn't simply discount a properly upconverted SDVD. These are my observations, and I am the type of guy who gets up in the middle of a movie to flick away a speck I noticed on the screen.

Griz

Well heck, Toshiba should've never waisted their time with HD-DVD then. Why not just go with Super upconverting DVD players to begin with.

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Well heck, Toshiba should've never waisted their time with HD-DVD then. Why not just go with Super upconverting DVD players to begin with.

I have a feeling that was meant to be sarcarstic, unieye, *wink* but I will be the first to say HDM did not blow me away when I first saw it. I guess the Oppo is just that good of an upconverter.

Griz

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On the other hand, many of the new transfers being done for true high-definition releases on Blu-ray (and for a time HD-DVD) are actually being done at 2K or even 4K or higher resolution, and then they're downconverted to 1080p.

That's a bit of misinformation. Warner scanned Bladerunner at 4K for ALL the versions they released. Blu-ray, HD-DVD, and DVD. Then downconverted it to 1080P and 480i respectively. Technically any DVD that is mastered in HD is done this way and that's most modern releases.

[Post edited by Movielover316 on Mar 6, 2008]

Bill Hunt again reaffirms his 'Richard Head' status

The guy would have you actually believe that Bleu-Ray was superior to a a LIVE PERFORMANCE, because the Bit Rate of a Bleu Ray player is actually higher than that of the Human Brain.

Can't beat that Lossless 7.1 audio you get from Bleu as well, since you only have 2 ears and probably suffer from a small amount of hearing loss, you can't get the full experience of a LIVE PERFORMANCE's audio unless you hear it played back on Bleu Ray as well.

"But the fact that a player - be it HD, BR, or SD - can redo the picture and put forth an image that enhances the original is IMHO acceptable."

But that doesn't seem to be what Toshiba is saying. They do seem to claim that they will make a pciture as good as an hd mastered image. That's bull fuckin horse shit.

I agree the Upconverted technology is way overated, just my opinion though.

All this Hatred "ahem"... interest over a hardware that is STILL NOT OUT YET, just makes it MORE interesting for people like me to scrutinize- when it comes out. Now I can't wait to check it out.

Who knows... these COLORFUL criticism may just be a smokescreen, to stave off that FEAR of sudden COMPETITION against blu-ray.

Hey xplaytendo... as a Blu-ray supporter, I come out the winner if the Toshiba Super-Upconversion becomes a success - consider...

If Toshiba possibly scores a 'hit' with S-Up technology and sales, this will put even more pressure on Blu-ray to lower the prices of it's players/discs, perhaps faster than they want to, although the prices will come down anyway in time.

So, I say - bring it on Toshiba, and may you hit a 'home run' with S-Up. Then the Blu-ray industry will respond with even lower prices.

Still, there's no way a disc played on a S-Up player will ever rival true High-Definition - once you get used to HD discs, you will always notice that SD-DVD (even upconverted) doesn't look as good. It's acceptable for general viewing, and I still buy and watch SD-DVDs on sale, but HD is where I'm see my primary movie collecting for the future (Blu-ray), not adding a S-Up player.

-JIMI (the Voodoo Child)

[Post edited by Love Hendrix! on Mar 7, 2008]